Rudy Giuliani Horoscope
The Hellenistic Legacy (astrologyinstitute.com)
I have previously questioned whether Hellenistic astrology has any real practical application for us in the 21st Century. Joseph C. Crane, M.A, author of Astrological Roots: The Hellenistic Legacy, contacted me and has agreed for me to quote from his website. In particular, Joseph has shown an example of the practical application of Hellenistic astrology in “A Practical Beginning to Hellenistic Astrology.” In this article he uses the life of Rudy Giuliani and goes through the Hellenistic method to explain how it shows two important facets of Giuliani’s life, his prominent career as a leader, and his “noteworthy” personal life.
Joseph has done an excellent job wading through the complex Hellenistic techniques to come up with some answers, and as he says, “The purpose of this article is to let the reader dip into the Hellenistic tradition to get a sense of its style and to decide whether to include some of it in his or her astrology practice.” I am going to show how another method can explain Giuliani’s prominent career and personal life as a comparison. To keep the playing field level, I will only look at the traditional planets, and use only one method, fixed star interpretation, an astrological method being used at the same times in history as Hellenistic astrology. Just one method, not a full interpretation.
Noteworthy Personal Life
Sun conjunct Ain “Staggering increase in sexual urge, a dissolute life, excessive and licentious ways. With Sun: Evil disposition (used to be a term in astrology for homosexuality).”
Mercury on Almach “a liking for change, diversion and amusement”.
Venus on Alcyone “Not a good omen with regard to relationships to the opposite sex (homosexual). with Venus: Immoral, strong passions, disgrace through women”.
Saturn conjunct Betelgeuse “With Saturn: Shrewd, cunning, craftily dishonest, treacherous to friends, eventful life with many ups and downs, eventual wealth but little comfort, unfavorable for domestic matters.”
Using the Hellenistic method, because the Sun is 8 degrees from Venus, “According to Hellenistic doctrine, a planet in this condition – within fifteen degrees of the Sun — is weaker than it otherwise would be and could manifest in a distorted or inconsistent way….Being within the Sun’s beams weakens an otherwise dignified Venus, giving a strong hint of instability or unpredictability.” Also, based on the Lot of Venus being in Virgo, governed by Mercury, “The testimony by Mars and Jupiter in the 12th, however, indicate a tendency to extreme (and possibly self-destructive) emotions and behavior in the sphere of relationships and marriage.”
Rudy Giuliani in Drag (pmcaregivers.com)
So from the fixed stars we get increased sexual urge, excessive, licentious, liking for change and amusement, immoral, disgrace through women, treacherous to friends, unfavorable for domestic matters, homosexuality.
From Hellenistic astrology we get a distorted and inconsistent love nature (Venus) with instability or unpredictability, a tendency to extreme (and possibly self-destructive) emotions and behaviour with relationships.
Prominence and Leadership Qualities
Sun conjunct Ain “Striving for prestige leading to power politics”.
Mercury conjunct Almach “honor, eminence…The popularity of these people will bring benefits from others.”
Venus conjunct Alcyone “eminence…ambition and endeavor, which gives preferment, honor and glory”.
Saturn conjunct Betelgeuse “indicative of great fortune, martial honors and “kingly” attributes…Placed in the angles (conjunct MC), preferment, luck, success and everlasting fame are promised.”
I’ll let you guys read through the Hellenistic interpretation of this one, it really is very complex and still does not give anywhere near the accurate description given by the stars. I am not criticising Joseph or his interpretation. I am however very critical of Hellenistic methods. Extremely technical and long-winded, they go in a round about way and I think you can make just about anything fit because of the multitude of rules and regulations.
You can see what I am getting at by looking at the noteworth personal life interpretation earlier. Just one method without any aspect analysis gave a far more accurate description than was obtained by using all the Hellenistic methods available.
Looking Forward, Looking Back
Stonehenge (trucospc.info )
I see Hellenistic astrology as a corruption of ancient astrology because it is based on fixed zodiac signs with no real relationship to the cosmos. The ancients, the Egyptians, Sumerians and the Celts saw the planets against the backdrop of the stars, just as all indigenous cultures do today. By moving away from this essential relationship with the cosmos, Hellenistic astrology ignored the fundamental principle “as above, so below”. Now mainstream astrology is stuck with the hangover of Hellenistic astrology, people believe that the 12 sun signs give influence to planets and we still have all the rules about planets being strong or weak depending on which sign they are in.
Earths Core Crystal (crystalinks.com)
How does an imagined 30 degree division on a piece of paper impart any energy to a planet? We know that the fixed stars are a source of energy, we can see then and can measure their various forms of electromagnetic energy, just as we can for the planets. We can even measure the energy coming from celestial objects we cannot see. The most recent scientific research supports the idea that the central core of the Earth is a single gigantic Iron crystal, nearly the size of our Moon. We know Iron has great electromagnetic properties and that crystals also have special qualities. This gives us an explanation of how astrology actually works. Energy from celestial bodies, the sun, planets and stars are picked up by this giant crystal under our feet. That combined energy is processed and emitted back to us. The energy is always changes due to the motion of the planets in relation to each other and to the fixed stars, so the energy we get from our central crystal is constantly changing, explaining the changes we experience in our personal lives and in the mundane world.
So right now Mars is stationary direct within a degree of last July’s massive Solar Eclipse degree. That eclipse, the longest for the rest of our lives, was on the fixed star alpha Monoceros. In 363 AD there was another massive Solar Eclipse, the longest Solar Eclipse between 744 BC and 2186 AD. That eclipse was also on the fixed star alpha Monoceros, the “One Horned”, and it marked the end of Paganism in the Western World and cemented Christianity in the Empire. With the asteroid Atropos also with Mars now, I think it is time to cut the link to the Patriarchal domination of the past. We don’t really need to rely on strict rules and regulations in astrology. Time to bring back the magic!
Jamie Funk 11 March 2010
Related Posts
The July 2009 Solar Eclipse and 363 AD
JFunky! Is that really Rudy Giuliani?
No wonder I liked him so much when he was mayor
.
yes it is him, and great to see him enjoying himself, expressing his true nature without inhibition.
It was so interesting to read the Hellenistic Interp. Pretty impressive. But now that I have seen the technicalities in all their glory, it does seems to me a little like an astrological paint by numbers. Like if you follow the rules EXACTLY, mix the paints with 1 part white, 2 part red etc etc. then you will get an accurate representation of the portrait sitter. The guidelines are there, you just need a steady hand and a good technique. It doesn’t give you much room to get creative, but it does seem very accurate as far as surface appearance goes. Describing the personality of a human being.
Modern astrology with it’s use of a wider palette of planets, asteroids, fixed stars is not really about surface representation, its about digging out the parts of the soul you can’t see, painting what’s inside. This way, there is more possibility that one Astrologer will see something completely different in a person than another and possibly bring out aspects, they may not even knew existed. But there is also room for a great deal of fantasy and the chance of being way off beam.
The big question for most people these days seems to be, who the hell am I? Although modern astrology has its “fluffs” and “Wooo woos”, how far below the surface can Hellenistic Astrology go? How can intuition flow within such a rigid framework? I have yet to get a reading from a Hellenistic Astrologer, so maybe I am being rather unfair here.
For myself, the more I delve into the myths of the heavens, the more amazed I am at the rich psychic inspiration and synchro mysticism it inspires.
I just can’t be doing with “Sects” and “Zoidions”!
I really appreciate your work with fixed stars, Jamie, your vision and the courage to speak about what you see. I am a vedic astrology student after most of my life studying western astrology. One of the reasons I find jyotish so fulfilling is the basis of Nakshatras – the mansions of the Moon as they are referred often, but they are the constellations from which the grahas (planets) receive their energy and, in turn, “channel” to us here on planet earth. The rasi’s (signs) are the last thing considered. The word “rasi” in sanskrit means simply a mathematical measure of 30 degrees. The signs are not conscious, meaning they are not embodied avatars, using Vedic terms – incarnations of Vishnu – i.e. the consciousness of God manifest. The signs are unconscious. They are merely the environment in which a planet does its job in our present life. More important to interpret what Nakshatra that planet is in, and what tara (star). The concept of lunar days, tithis, is the movement of the Moon through these contellations – it is much more revealing on a daily basis what energy is being beamed to us mortals on Earth than following the Sun’s movement through signs! It’s a fascinating study, to observe what the potential is, and what unfolds – the correlation can be readily seen, as you well know and report.
It’s a complex, multi-dimensional phenomenon – and it’s my personal belief that the nakshatras are the neumenon – the center from which phenomenon and energy are generated. At this point, I think they are the genesis of archetypes. The Greeks came along and assigned earthly animal symbols to what was simple measurements of 30 degrees applied to viewing the ecliptic. As you clearly stated, other cultures already had names and assignments to the various fixed stars and constellations.
Seems to me that looking at a person’s chart defined by earthly animal terms applies to one’s psychology and character, and serves to validate their psychology and not the spiritual core/force/potential of each individual from where they are operating – which is – how are the planets working together within each individual – how is the consciousness of God assisting in manifesting the potential in that person’s life? What is the soul’s journey, what karma is there to be worked through this time? To me, simply looking at signs doesn’t answer these questions. Just as simply looking at the Rasi chart only reveals one dimension (the body, the character, the health of that person). We use many charts (vargas) that go deeper beneath the surface. Talk about complex! But it really isn’t for it reveals so much in the process.
The Nakshatras (constellations) are the mystical dimension of astrology – a deep and vast territory of true magick to explore – beyond the sun signs and the ecliptic realm, which, granted, has its place and purpose but…there’s so much more! I like a more universal approach! (sun conjunct uranus?)
And this seems harmonious to your design of fixed sign astrology which is fascinating and well worth more attention and research – and discussion! I really like how you compared the two systems! And I must admit, I have never deeply studied Hellenistic astrology but I thoroughly enjoyed Joseph Crane’s lecture at the 2008 Blast conference and bought his Practical Beginning book because of it. He explained the techniques very clearly and with great humor too! But the next day was Vedic, and my heart was opened wide
(Now I’m curious and am going to look at Rudy’s vedic chart!)
Thank you, Jamie! Rock on
(I hope it doesn’t come across like I’m preaching vedic…I like it when connections are made in different systems ’cause Astrology is Astrology – when you get to the root of it, and it’s all beautiful!) I do struggle with getting to the point – please pardon my long-winded post!)
thanks for your detailed reply Vanessa. i do think the Vedic system is a big improvement on the tropical zodiac because it takes into account the precession of the equinoxes. and i use the Nakshatras myself. what i find really interesting is that the lunar mansions are nearly exactly the same, based on the same fixed stars for the Arabic, Hindu and Chinese Moon Mansions.
the stars in general have very similar interpretations and mythology accross all cultures.
Wow Vanessa, thank’s for that informative post on Vedic Astrology. I’m really fascinated by it. And I certainly want to get myself a Vedic reading at some point.
I think a cultures astrological system is a reflection of it’s religion. I got yelled at for saying this on a forum once….But it’s so obvious!! Eastern/Reincarnation=Vedic, Western/Christians=Hellenistic, Western/Hippies=Evolutionary, Western/Agnostic=Psychological….Maybe I’m stereotyping here, but who cares. Aries, Taurus, Gemini…..;)
You’re welcome Marina! I don’t think you’re stereotyping – I think you’ve made a relevant, profound and logical point there. It makes sense to me! For what captured me IS the Vendanta philosophy, the religious/devotional/Hindu aspect that appeals for its poetic and divinely beautiful (it satisfies my Neptune yearnings!) art and the science of yoga that weaves itself in, through, and all around the teachings. Jyotish is a branch of yoga, it’s a spiritual discipline and path in itself. It has brought astrology to life, inside of me. And isn’t that the whole point of any system or I guess the term is ‘model’? How can one speak for the energy if one don’t know the language and feel it? What are the planets *saying* in your heart? It’s one’s philosophy, one’s faith that colors our perspectives, be it Dieties, the myths, a psychology, what have you…I’m probably much too naive in my approach and philosophy, but there it is. I love exploring cross-cultural interpretations and the symbolic synastry. (And I love Sanskrit!!!) So it stands to reason that there will always be controversy because there are always scholars of different religions/philosophy or agnostics and scientists debating translations and the meanings of ancient teachings, and the researches go on (thankfully!) Everyone has their role in this play. I also like Jamie’s approach and philosophy – of bringing the ‘astro’ back into astrology! That’s what compelled me to share about Vedic, because the astro is there!
Your articles are rich in knowledge; you’re in tune with Lilith and the language that you use to express what lives in/through you hits the mark! You illustrate visually and with words with such passion that others can understand clearly and that’s a wonderful gift! It just baffles me that people actually fight, and get viscious even, over which system works or not. (But religion is ultimately why people wage war, so it’s not really surprising. Let’s evolve already!) What compels me is the truth, the Universal truth I just want to get to the root of understanding, ya know? It’s the masculine and feminine, the dark and the light, the yab/yum, the Shiva/Shakti – the kundalini force of the Universe that’s being lived, shown, for us to realize and understand and expand our consciousness!
I highly recommend a vedic reading, yes! Especially if you’re up for getting, as Dennis Harness said once, an astrological make-over!
And I just read your fascinating article on the Ghost Moon in Lewis Carroll, Johnny Depp, Tim Burton and Hitler’s charts… that was excellent! The Penguin publication of Alice in Wonderland that I bought last year included an indepth biography of Carroll – and the story apparently came from his visits with a family that lived nearby, and it came to him while they were rowing in a boat on the Thames one day, he telling Alice a story to entertain her and her sister, and she helped in creating the story. It is reportedly based on his interractions with this young girl, Alice, whom he had contact with for many years. She was basically his muse. Questionable pedophaelia too, but a fascinating study of character, that one -Mr. Dodgson.
You may appreciate this bit of trivia – it took the illustrator, John Tenniel, 2 years to complete the art for that book! But it gave Dodgson the time to refine his great work.
I so enjoy both your and Jamie’s innovative expressions!